Pig & Whistle Tales - A World of Warcraft Podcast

Redefining Challenges in the World of Warcraft

• Gabriel • Season 4 • Episode 57

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Unlock the secrets to mastering World of Warcraft as we dissect the latest updates and controversies rocking Azeroth. Want to outsmart the world boss Kordak or survive the chaos of the South Shore vs. Tarren Mill brawl? We've got you covered with strategic insights and tips that will keep you ahead of the curve. Get ready to rethink your approach to the Season of Discovery as we compare its challenges and mechanics to those of classic WoW experiences. Is modern WoW too simple, or is it a fresh twist on a beloved game? Our hot take on this debate might surprise you.

Join us as we navigate the ever-evolving landscape of PvP in World of Warcraft. Learn how the Battleground Blitz can be your gateway into the competitive arena and why tackling capped MMR in solo shuffle could be key to invigorating the PvP scene. We'll explore the potential for Classic WoW to expand with unique new content, turning iconic locations into thrilling raids. Whether you're a seasoned veteran or a newbie eager to jump in, this episode promises a treasure trove of insights and discussions tailored just for you.

Hope you all enjoy and hope you relate to any of these stories. And I will speak to you all in the next episode!

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Speaker 1:

Music. Thank you, hello, and welcome to the Pig and Whistle Tales from Azeroth. As always here at the Pig and Whistle Inn in Stormwind, I go through a variety of subjects With regards to World of Warcraft. A grub, a bottle or a pint? Sit back and enjoy this episode. We'll be going over a few bits and bobs in relation to pvp and, as well, season of discovery. Now these are all forum posts that I want to address, either give my opinions on, tell this person that they're silly for thinking this way, or agreeing with them. The latter is kind of never usually happening, but at some point in their big blocks of writing there are points that I can actually agree with and sort of expand on. But we, as always, start off with the weekly news. You have kordak as your world boss for the week. He is located in the isle of dawn. Um, let me just double check. Yep, isle of Dawn, because you've got Ringing Deeps. Yeah, yeah, sorry, khazal-gar is the mainland. Isle of Dawn is the first zone. I still get them two mixed up every now and again.

Speaker 1:

Delves are your bonus event for this week, so what this means is you get more loot for completing delves. It's essentially the same as your dungeon week, but a delve basis. Very simple. You have South Shore versus Tower Mill as your brawl for the week. This is essentially the map of Heelsbrad and it is 40 versus 40, and it's first to essentially lose their 150 reinforcements. You have reinforcements per death, so when 150 deaths occur on your team, that is when you will lose. Very simple, please don't do this. If you have a potato of a pc, it will blow it up and you will, um, probably not have a pc for a few days, if not a week. Um, yeah, that's the sad thing about this brawl. I absolutely love it because it's just an absolute shit show. But, um, yeah, it can blow up your pc. Even like decent pcs they can struggle running this.

Speaker 1:

And for your mythic affixes, you have tyrannical and void bound. Now, tyrannical is the bosses and the minions that they spawn have increased damage and health, and void bound is another one of the zalatath's um mythic affixes. Essentially, I believe it's zalatath that spawns, or an emissary of hers, and it will put a shield on on all of the adds that are currently there. This shield is a damage reduction, like 99, and essentially you can only single target the emissary, slash zalatath and when you kill zalatath, the shield dissipates and you can go back to aoeing the packs. Very simple, okay. So please switch and kill the emissary slash zalatath. It will help you guys out in the run. But it has to be single target because cleave literally doesn't matter when the shield is up. It really, really doesn't. And I've heard that you do not do enough damage when you are cleaving um to the emissary slash zalataf. So please switch on the target and make sure that target dies quickly. Thank you very much.

Speaker 1:

So the first one I wanted to start off with was game too easy. Okay, now, what do you think? Give me a guess. Is this retail? Is this classic? Is this season of discovery? What one do you think it is? If he said season of discovery, you would be correct. So why, before I get into the forum post, do you guys think season of discovery is difficult? Okay, do you think classic is more difficult than season of discovery? Raid wise, so far I I have yet to know. Really, I would say season of discovery brings more challenges, um, and more mechanics. I wouldn't say it's more difficult, though I would say it's different. Okay, so let's see what this guy's point is.

Speaker 1:

I've been raiding blackwing lair for a bit. After coming back from phase one, I do not understand this current game. I'm thinking of quitting. How is blasting through three trials that be so easy? Just pulling all trash and aoeing them down? There is no mechanics to respect, no feeling that your effort gets rewarded. The deal is play three hours, get one million loot congratulations. I think that's a bit of an over exaggeration. Uh, there is a bit more, but what I will start off saying is this is what classic was and is. You cannot do many more mechanics in the classic engine of world of warcraft without going into sort of a more updated version of world of warcraft, if that makes sense. So classics mechanics were very, very simplified. You were talking in blackwing.

Speaker 1:

Lair, the first boss, is probably the most mechanically worrying, I think, and that is simply dealing with adds and blowing up some eggs. The worst thing about it is you're waiting for the cooldown to destroy the eggs. That's the mechanic, essentially For Valstras, the second boss. You are simply moving out. If you get a burning adrenaline and someone dies, that's it. That's the mechanic. You die after 12 seconds. Um, you can't do anything about it. You can't block it, you can't um bubble it, you can't do any sort of immunities. You just die, um. So you do damage and then you run away and die off in a corner by yourself. So you don't blow up the raid and the tank will get a reduced health debuff and eventually die if you don't kill it quick enough. So the second person in threat just needs to be the off tank. It's that simple.

Speaker 1:

These are the mechanics of classic. Okay, um, this is why you can't really do much about it, and every single trash pack in Classic has little to no mechanics. Okay, I'm trying to think of trash packs that actually did something. I think the only thing that trash packs did was if it was a mounted sort of unit, a mounted mob, it would charge the range to, like past pastors, so everyone would just stack on its ass. Um, I'm pretty sure they are the only mechanics that were kind of used in classic. I don't remember many, uh, that were needed to be moved out of anything or anything along them lines. It was just more about positioning of the raid group. Um.

Speaker 1:

So, going back to the blackwing layer, three trials. What the trials did was they added certain mechanics. Blue added an arcane bomb where you had to stack so that you know the damage was split. Uh, bronze added a sort of time warp element to it where you slow up and speed up time, stuff like that. So all of these trials do add extra mechanics, but again, these are simple mechanics that are going to not break the game but they're also not going to be really, really engaging. They are very good and they are needed because classic mechanics are needed, but again, they're not going to be amazing. They're not going to be like legion or battle for azeroth or shadowlands, dragonflight, etc. They aren't going to be these types of mechanics that are going to be, you know, really intricate and you have to have a whole raid group move in one direction at the same time or split up or, you know, dps a couple ads at different times.

Speaker 1:

I think you know you can only do so much with Classic. So I it's tough to judge them based on what they currently are, to be honest, because classic mechanics will never be that of retail mechanics they really won't. But I think that they are doing a decent job in Season of Discovery with adding other bits and bobs, different elements to the older raids that classic wouldn't have had otherwise. So he carries on From my experience from original classic game is easy, but you have to respect some mechanics and play accordingly to it to be um, this is a mindless. The trials were supposed to add difficulty, but they just give extra free loot instead, dg hard mode being a complete joke, giving three idols. How can this be fun to people? Okay, so what mechanics needed to be respected in the original uh classic that aren't currently in season of discovery?

Speaker 1:

Balestras still has burning adrenaline. Balestras still has his tank debuff. He has the same mechanics. Uh, razor gore in black wing lair has the exact same mechanics. Okay, you have to destroy all the eggs, etc. Etc. All of the same, kill the ads. Very much the same mechanics.

Speaker 1:

Um, what's the next one? Is it brood lord? Yeah, brood lord is the next boss, and that is very simple. Again, he charges people. That's kind of it. You just stop, damage, reset the aggro, pick him up again. Nothing too simple or too painful, to be honest, fire more. Uh, you are essentially just line of sighting when he does his. Uh, what is it? Flame buffer? So you don't want to get too many stacks. You line a site. It's that simple. That is the mechanic of classic.

Speaker 1:

Okay, you've had three dragons that basically did the same, which is a wing buff it, which will fling the tank back, and then the off tank simply picks it up, or the off tank taunts and then the off tank deck gets the wing buff it and the main tank will get right back because it is a threat reduction the wing buffet. So these mechanics are not difficult. They are still the exact same mechanics as are as what is in classic, and yet he's saying it's easier in classic, even though they've added multiple different mechanics to it. That isn't the case. It isn't the case. It isn't the case at all. No matter how you spin it, it is not the case that that will be easier because, simply, if you're doing these three um trials essentially these bronze, uh, blue, red and green trials in blackwing lair you're getting a minimum of three extra mechanics. Okay, they might not be engaging mechanics, they might not be great mechanics, but they are classic mechanics. Okay, there's only so much they can do with the classic engine. Yeah, so, no matter what, you have the original mechanics of bosses, but then you add on the extra three. Okay, so it makes it.

Speaker 1:

It makes no sense how it's easier than original classic, when I remember doing fire more back in classic in 2020, 2019, when? When did blackwing lair come out? 2020, I think it came out in 2020, um, but I remember doing blackwing lair in classic and you have the tanks that are in the middle of a doorway. You have the range one side and you have the melees one side and you got to three stacks. You line-assighted the boss and you stood there for 20 seconds waiting for your flame buffet to drop off. That was the mechanic you waited. How enjoyable is that? That's not enjoyable at all, is it so how does adding three extra mechanics make it easier? It doesn't it just straight up, doesn't does it? It's a ludicrous thing to suggest and it's I don't know. You just can't compare the two, because seasonal discovery is trying to do something different.

Speaker 1:

Now take this into a context of retail. The recent Race to World First has just ended and everyone who watched that saw the mechanics, the amount of mechanics that were needed in order to finish a boss. Now, let's say these mechanics were easy for this person, too easy. Let's add an extra three mechanics that can happen throughout the entire fight, anywhere, throughout the entire fight. Then what is it? Is it still just as easy for this person? Well, according to him that's how it would work. But no, if you add more mechanics in any fight, they are going to be tougher. Even if it is still an easy fight, it's still going to be a tougher fight because of this.

Speaker 1:

So the logic behind this statement makes no sense at all and again, I feel like it's just people trying to start something that isn't needed to be started, because blizzard are doing well, in my opinion, with season of discovery, and I think that they've done very well with introducing new mechanics, runes, the balancing stuff. I think that they've done really, really well with it. But I think that people will always find something to complain about, in my honest opinion, and I genuinely think that these are sort of tests, these mechanics, these runes to go into, maybe Burning Crusade and then wrath of the lich king and stuff like that. Um, I would like to hope that they stick with classic um for obvious reasons, because I think the classic engine and what they can do with classic is a lot more than what they could do with, like just going through the expansions again, like burning crusade, wrath of the lich king. But with classic they have karazhan crypts that they could open as a raid. They could turn skull and monastery into a raid. They could turn dire maw into like a giant raid or something as well. Like you have different versions of this, so they can do a lot more of classic and they can make it into a sandbox mode, and I think that's the way that they will be going with it and I'm all for it.

Speaker 1:

To be honest, I really would like to see more stuff like that, where they're just doing completely new raids, such as Karazhan Crypts or where's something else that could be good, maybe like an Orgrimmar raid or a Stormwind raid. You know you have that different uhades raid. Obviously you'd have to allow the Horder Alliance to get into these raids because you can't put the entrance in the middle of Stormwind, can you? So you know there's many different things that they could do with it. But if people are going to complain that the mechanics are too easy, that is what classic is. That is the fundamental flaw of classic that the mechanics for this day and age, for all of the information we have, for the PC upgrades we have, for the internet upgrade we have, they are too simple. These were mechanics that were meant for people on dial-up internet, on a potato that is literally running their World of Warcraft and a monitor that is about two inches by two inches wide. You know it's ridiculous, so you cannot compare it to any sort of retail mechanic, but I think they are doing a great job in the additional stuff that they are adding to the game, such as the extra NPCs, runes, the mechanics that they add. I think they're doing a very good job and this is kind of upsetting to see, because it's such a different take on World of Warcraft, season of Discovery that I hope that it does. Well, I really really do, and I hope that whatever they bring out in the future is something that will bring people back to season of discovery, as it is one of the least played warcrafts. But hey, what, what? What do you guys think on season of discovery? I think that it's a very good concept and I think that when they start making newer content for it content that isn't released I think that's when it will become a bit of a you know standalone world of warcraft. But currently, um, it's just an additional few things that have been added alongside the classic release schedule back in 2019, slash 2020, um. So I think that's why people are giving it a bit of a you know, side eye at the moment, but when they release newer content that's not in any other world of warcraft that's when it will, uh, boom. Essentially that's when it will become very, very good in my own opinion.

Speaker 1:

But let's carry on, we'll head to the next post now, this next post. I'm trying to decide between three, but I'm going to start with this one and see where we end up. So pvp is dead, uncut. Uncap shuffle mmr. Oh my god, why was that so tough to say? Uncap shuffle mmr? Yeah, that shouldn't have been that difficult to say my, my tongue got twisted. Essentially. So no expansion launch in the history has been dead before, has been this dead before, and all blizzard could think about is capping solo shuffle mmr at 2100 to force people to play the new great game mode. In reality, though, it seems like no one cares, since shuffle still has more players than blitz by rating being essentially capped at 2200. Imagine how active arenas could be if ratings were uncapped, like in Blitz. So there is more to this, but I'll start there. So, with Battleground Blitz being added, it does give people the option to start learning PvP in a rated environment.

Speaker 1:

Now I personally don't see Battleground Blitz as a main World of Warcraftvp staple point at the end game. I see it as a stepping stone into getting into arenas or solo shuffle. As for the past oh god, 15 years no, it'll be more, 20, about 17 years arenas have been the end point of world of warcraft pvp. You don't get to the max level and then you don't go. Oh, my god, I just want to do battlegrounds. Some people do. That's completely fine. I admire you for that, because I think battlegrounds can be very good and enjoyable and I certainly find my own way in battlegrounds, doing what I like in them, which is trying to find people to 1v1. Essentially, I think that that's a very enjoyable way of doing a battleground because it allows me to build up my skill in that environment rather than just getting one shot by 10 people randomly, that kind of deal.

Speaker 1:

Now I think that Blitz I get that they're trying to push blitz more. I think that capping solo shuffle is a bad idea. I I genuinely do. I get that you add mmr shortly or slowly into like every sort of arena bracket, whether it be 2v2, 3v3, um, solo shuffle etc. But if one of them is uncapped and the others are, it doesn't make a lot of sense because battleground blitz is currently uncapped and I think solo shuffle, like this guy said, is about 2200 where it is capped, which is a bit unfortunate. I I don't quite understand that reasoning. I think that if you uncap it allows people to get um more alts up to that level if they really wanted to try and play more alts. It becomes more alt friendly because you're constantly having to battle the mmr system on your main to push even though the mmr just isn't there. It isn't injected into the game yet, which isn't great, I'm not gonna lie. But you know, it's one of them things I don't like the way that they are trying to push blitz in comparison to arenas that when it has been arenas that have been the main staple point of end game for the past 17 odd years, um, however long since tbt came out, essentially, um, I don't know.

Speaker 1:

Let's see what else he has to say. The self-sabotage is crazy. This expansion, if they don't change anything about the shuffle mmr soon, I'll just quit again. Since blizzard obviously doesn't want to retain arena players, I couldn't care less about blitz. It's literally a coin flip every match. Let me play at least one arena bracket.

Speaker 1:

Okay, this guy has simply only stated about 21 or solo shuffle. He has not mentioned 2v2, 3v3 at all. Now, don't get me wrong. There is still a cap in 3v3 and 2v2. And I would imagine that there's going to be a hard cap. But I believe that there are people up there who are 2500. Okay, like high, 2400, 2500, that's about it. I think that's the cap currently.

Speaker 1:

These are rank one players. Obviously, I'm a very decent pvp player myself, I would like to say so. I'm currently sat at 18, 15, 1900. Okay, it's a decent start at the season, but they need to not fall into the trap of letting the MMR be very uh, what is it diminished? Because in Dragonflight in, I think, season three, they had a problem where they just didn't inject any sort of MMR into the game at all, which is a real problem because it ended up with rank one players being at 2,500, 2,600 and people who are usually getting GLAD at a sort of 2,100, 2,200 ish. Now, again, this isn't a problem. Glad should be something that you strive for, but you've got to make it at least a little bit more accessible. My honest opinion to those who aren't just rank one players okay, now, I think that anywhere between a rank one player being at 28, 2900 and 3k just being sort of the cap. I think that that is fine.

Speaker 1:

I think why not just open it up to 3k, mmr being the maximum mmr that you can be? Just make it difficult to get there, kind of like overwatch uh season or overwatch one, where you had a rating between zero and five thousand, five thousand being the best, and players could get up to about 4700 and then it would be a real tough job to get into 4800. 4900 is almost impossible, same with 5K, but you still had that option to really try and push it. So you know why not do something like that and I will stand by that. Why not try and do it? But you know it's tough to say it really, really is.

Speaker 1:

I think that they do need to look at the mmr injection a bit and maybe up it to a certain point and like just give us up to 3k mmr and be like this is it. It's not going to fluctuate between um going up and down from this number. Good luck to all of you. This is what it is for the season, as long as the season doesn't drag on for about four months, four, five, six months. However, you want like a season every few months, ish, okay. So you know, three months, great. Two months even better. It really keeps it, you know, competitive and it allows people to constantly go back to their mains to get their rating back up for the new season etc. Maybe something along them lines.

Speaker 1:

But honestly I'm not too bothered about it at the moment because what blizzard are doing with their current balance changes with the 11.0.5 already uh, highly underway on the ptr. We know that we're going to get massive balance changes coming with that, so maybe they'll introduce something with the MMR system during that. But I'm not a big fan of why they're trying to push Blitz to be the main staple point. I would like Blitz to be a sort of stepping on point for those who wanted to do rated PvP in the later game, who aren't as comfortable going into an arena setting yet, or a solo shuffle. So that's my honest opinion on this matter. I don't think this guy's wrong, but I don't think having a sort of moan about it is going to help. I think trying to give any sort of constructive criticism is very good rather than just saying I'm going to quit. Essentially I'll just quit again, since blizzard obviously doesn't want to retain arena players, like they are constantly doing balance changes. I know it might not be just for arena players, it's probably for pve players, but they are taking pvp into consideration, even though we are kind of we're kind of the second child, let's face it. Actually, no, second child is always good, we're the middle child. That's the one, the middle child. Yeah, so it is what it is, but hopefully we will see a injection of mmr soon into pvp. But that is where I will end it for this episode.

Speaker 1:

Sorry, um, my voice is going a bit again, not been feeling 100 these past few days. But thank you all very much for listening. Do check out all of the socials down below. Constant stuff is happening over there. And do check out, uh, the etsy shop. More stuff is being added constantly throughout the day, so please do check it out. If there's anything you want, please throw me a message. Order on etsy, etc. Etc. But thank you all very much once again and go, avala friend, goodbye. Thank you all very much once again and go, avala friend, goodbye. Thank you.